Hi everyone, I'm currently studying for my Master's in Computer
Science, and I will be working on my thesis this summer. I've been
thinking about constructing a web services application for my thesis,
as I've been interested in this technology, and I haven't had a chance
to work with it in my last job. The issue is what platform to use:
..NET or J2EE?
Prior to starting my MSc course, I worked for a software developer for
five years where I wrote Windows apps in Visual C++. However, during
my MSc course (which lasts a year), we've been working in J2SE and
nothing else (as far as programming languages go). So even though I
have more experience in C++, Java is fresher in my mind right now.
Since we're learning J2SE, I took a look at the J2EE 1.4 tutorial on
Sun's web site, and it completely blew me away. It looks like
something it would take years to master, (I only have three months to
do this project) and it seems that you have to be an expert in J2SE
before tackling J2EE.
If I went with .NET, I already have experience with Microsoft
development tools, so the learning curve might be quicker. But as my
previous experience is in Visual C++ 6.0, .NET will be a whole new
ballgame for me too. Oh, and I would have to shell out big money for
the Visual Studio toolset. It would be at academic price, and I
probably only need Visual C++ or C#, but it still costs money when the
J2EE environment is free.
What do you all think, given my past experience? I know there are
some people who abhor anything Microsoft, but being that I've worked
with early versions of the Visual Studio IDE, will .NET be a quick
learning curve? Or is J2EE not as hard to learn as it seems? If
anyone knows of any good tutorials on the internet, please point me in
that direction.
Also, since this is just for learning, the web services apps are not
going to be very elaborate, as I'm wondering if I'm already biting off
more than I can chew! However, I was wondering what people prefer
between .NET and J2EE and why. No flame wars, please, although I feel
that it's going to happen anyways.
Thanks for your feedback!
Herman
15  7619 
"Herman" <he*******@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:d6**************************@posting.google.c om... Hi everyone, I'm currently studying for my Master's in Computer
Science, and I will be working on my thesis this summer. I've been
thinking about constructing a web services application for my thesis,
as I've been interested in this technology, and I haven't had a chance
to work with it in my last job. The issue is what platform to use:
.NET or J2EE?
*snip*
I can't speak to .NET, and I have little real experience with anything
C-related. I've been learning and working in Java for the past year. From
this limited viewpoint, I would recommend Java because it seems to me more
idiot-proof than C. It won't let you do anything too crazy. It will just
calmly stop and tell you exactly what it doesn't like. It may not be quite
as flexible as C, but you sound like you want a language that is more likely
to guide you into what you should do than to crash with a sometimes cryptic
error message. That would be Java in my experience. J2EE can seem
overwhelming at first glance, but since you know J2SE already, if you hang
around comp.lang.java.help and comp.lang.java.programmer (not
comp.lang.java, it isn't technically supposed to exist) for a little while,
you should be able to pick up on the basics pretty quickly. And if you're
thinking Web Services, you can download JDeveloper, write a plain old J2SE
program, and essentially click a button to make it a Web Service and deploy
it for use. (I know that JDeveloper offers this functionality. I don't know
about other IDE's.) Again, I know Java much better than C/C++ or anything
..NET, so I can't say that I'm seeing it all clearly.
Herman wrote:
It looks like something it would take years to master, (I only have three months to
do this project) and it seems that you have to be an expert in J2SE
before tackling J2EE.
If I went with .NET, I already have experience with Microsoft
development tools, so the learning curve might be quicker. But as my
previous experience is in Visual C++ 6.0, .NET will be a whole new
ballgame for me too.
Bad news: Sorry to tell you that Microsoft totally (TOTALLY!) changed
the development environment in the .Net version of VC. So your VC++ 6
experience will not help a bit. I don't know J2EE, but I'll offer the
opinion that you're not going to get very productive in either J2EE or
..Net in a 3 month project.
--
Scott McPhillips [VC++ MVP] he*******@hotmail.com (Herman) wrote in message news:<d6**************************@posting.google. com>... Hi everyone, I'm currently studying for my Master's in Computer
Science, and I will be working on my thesis this summer. I've been
thinking about constructing a web services application for my thesis,
as I've been interested in this technology, and I haven't had a chance
to work with it in my last job. The issue is what platform to use:
.NET or J2EE?
For web services I would recommend going the .NET way. In my opinion the
web services platform is move evolved. Also, Visual Studio .NET has a
really good IDE.
Sandeep
-- http://www.EventHelix.com/EventStudio
EventStudio 2.0 - Generate Sequence Diagrams and Use Case Diagrams in PDF
"Herman" <he*******@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:d6**************************@posting.google.c om... Hi everyone, I'm currently studying for my Master's in Computer
Science, and I will be working on my thesis this summer. I've been
thinking about constructing a web services application for my thesis,
as I've been interested in this technology, and I haven't had a chance
to work with it in my last job. The issue is what platform to use:
.NET or J2EE?
Prior to starting my MSc course, I worked for a software developer for
five years where I wrote Windows apps in Visual C++. However, during
my MSc course (which lasts a year), we've been working in J2SE and
nothing else (as far as programming languages go). So even though I
have more experience in C++, Java is fresher in my mind right now.
Since we're learning J2SE, I took a look at the J2EE 1.4 tutorial on
Sun's web site, and it completely blew me away. It looks like
something it would take years to master, (I only have three months to
do this project) and it seems that you have to be an expert in J2SE
before tackling J2EE.
If I went with .NET, I already have experience with Microsoft
development tools, so the learning curve might be quicker. But as my
previous experience is in Visual C++ 6.0, .NET will be a whole new
ballgame for me too. Oh, and I would have to shell out big money for
the Visual Studio toolset. It would be at academic price, and I
probably only need Visual C++ or C#, but it still costs money when the
J2EE environment is free.
What do you all think, given my past experience? I know there are
some people who abhor anything Microsoft, but being that I've worked
with early versions of the Visual Studio IDE, will .NET be a quick
learning curve? Or is J2EE not as hard to learn as it seems? If
anyone knows of any good tutorials on the internet, please point me in
that direction.
Also, since this is just for learning, the web services apps are not
going to be very elaborate, as I'm wondering if I'm already biting off
more than I can chew! However, I was wondering what people prefer
between .NET and J2EE and why. No flame wars, please, although I feel
that it's going to happen anyways.
Thanks for your feedback!
Herman
Hi,
what you are looking for is a middleware and a thin client(web browser
based client). I would recommend from the long time point of view going with
C++ and CORBA. for the client use anything you please, asp, jsp or a GUI
based client developed wiht your c urrent vc wiht mfc knowledge.
kutty
Herman wrote: Hi everyone, I'm currently studying for my Master's in Computer
Science, and I will be working on my thesis this summer. I've been
thinking about constructing a web services application for my thesis,
as I've been interested in this technology, and I haven't had a chance
to work with it in my last job. The issue is what platform to use:
.NET or J2EE?
Your asking the wrong question, if you have a BCS you should know this
already. Which platform fits better for what YOU want to do, in the
constraints you have to live with. Don't say they are equal, because
they are not.
Some questions to ask yourself (you should know this already)
* What is the executing platform?
* How much do you need to master in order to do what you want to do?
* How far can you slide the time schedule?
* Which technology is going to be more useful after you graduate?
* Is this really what you want to do a thesis on?
Lets look at those a little closer, spending 2.9 months working on .Net
only to find out the thing will run on a platform which doesn't have
..Net isn't going to help. J2EE is more platform agnostic.
For a small project, you might not need to learn all that much, for a
large project, the learning curve may not fit in the time constraints.
you have available.
Since you ony have 3 months, you don't have a lot of schedule room.
..Net is dependant on Microsoft, so what if something happens to
Microsoft, then again J2EE is dependant on Sun.
Also, since this is just for learning, the web services apps are not
going to be very elaborate, as I'm wondering if I'm already biting off
more than I can chew! However, I was wondering what people prefer
between .NET and J2EE and why. No flame wars, please, although I feel
that it's going to happen anyways.
There are other choices too though, Zope which uses Python and good old
fashioned Perl and a text editor also work as web development
environments.
Paul
"Scott McPhillips [MVP]" <sc******@mvps.org.nothere> wrote in message news:<J9********************@comcast.com>... Herman wrote:
It looks like something it would take years to master, (I only have three months to
do this project) and it seems that you have to be an expert in J2SE
before tackling J2EE.
If I went with .NET, I already have experience with Microsoft
development tools, so the learning curve might be quicker. But as my
previous experience is in Visual C++ 6.0, .NET will be a whole new
ballgame for me too.
Bad news: Sorry to tell you that Microsoft totally (TOTALLY!) changed
the development environment in the .Net version of VC. So your VC++ 6
experience will not help a bit. I don't know J2EE, but I'll offer the
opinion that you're not going to get very productive in either J2EE or
.Net in a 3 month project.
Might consider an evaluation or academic verison of BEA Weblogic.
They have some very clear examples of webservices and their tools are
fairly straight forward. Disclaimer: I know squat about .NET
Herman posted: Hi everyone, I'm currently studying for my Master's in Computer
Science, and I will be working on my thesis this summer. I've been
thinking about constructing a web services application for my thesis,
as I've been interested in this technology, and I haven't had a chance
to work with it in my last job. The issue is what platform to use:
.NET or J2EE?
They're both abismal. I find it a joke that they can call it a "Master's"
when you're writing the program in the likes of .NET and J2EE.
-JKop
>The issue is what platform to use: .NET or J2EE?
Student=broke="free tools"=Java.
You can develop web services using gSoap for C++.
I have read some of the postings regarding difficulty, and I completely
disagree.
You can pick up Java and NetBeans from Sun, install, and start creating
simple web services in no-time.
..NET and J2EE share some of the same porblems and virtues, it's just
that Java is free, .NEt is not.
Prior to starting my MSc course, I worked for a software developer for
five years where I wrote Windows apps in Visual C++. However, during
my MSc course (which lasts a year), we've been working in J2SE and
nothing else (as far as programming languages go). So even though I
have more experience in C++, Java is fresher in my mind right now.
Since we're learning J2SE, I took a look at the J2EE 1.4 tutorial on
Sun's web site, and it completely blew me away. It looks like
something it would take years to master, (I only have three months to
do this project) and it seems that you have to be an expert in J2SE
before tackling J2EE.
Just install the tools, run a web service example, or run one of the web
service project templates, and you will learn what really matters....
If I went with .NET, I already have experience with Microsoft
development tools, so the learning curve might be quicker. But as my
previous experience is in Visual C++ 6.0, .NET will be a whole new
ballgame for me too. Oh, and I would have to shell out big money for
the Visual Studio toolset. It would be at academic price, and I
probably only need Visual C++ or C#, but it still costs money when the
J2EE environment is free.
BTW, .NET is not any easire to learn than Java...
No flame wars, please, although I feel
that it's going to happen anyways.
Bring up a topic about two languages unrelated to C++ in a C++ newsgroup
is not the greatest of ideas to avoid this...
JLR NU**@NULL.NULL wrote... Herman posted:
Hi everyone, I'm currently studying for my Master's in Computer
Science, and I will be working on my thesis this summer. I've been
thinking about constructing a web services application for my thesis,
as I've been interested in this technology, and I haven't had a chance
to work with it in my last job. The issue is what platform to use:
.NET or J2EE?
They're both abismal. I find it a joke that they can call it a "Master's"
when you're writing the program in the likes of .NET and J2EE.
Maybe it's a Mastercard Masters -- ie, night school. Nothing wrong
with it, but...well, don't ask 'em what a Turing machine is.
--
Don't believe anything unless you have thought it through for
yourself. (Anna Pell Wheeler, 1883-1966) he*******@hotmail.com (Herman) wrote in message news:<d6**************************@posting.google. com>... Hi everyone, I'm currently studying for my Master's in Computer
Science, and I will be working on my thesis this summer. I've been
thinking about constructing a web services application for my thesis,
as I've been interested in this technology, and I haven't had a chance
to work with it in my last job. The issue is what platform to use:
.NET or J2EE?
Prior to starting my MSc course, I worked for a software developer for
five years where I wrote Windows apps in Visual C++. However, during
my MSc course (which lasts a year), we've been working in J2SE and
nothing else (as far as programming languages go). So even though I
have more experience in C++, Java is fresher in my mind right now.
Since we're learning J2SE, I took a look at the J2EE 1.4 tutorial on
Sun's web site, and it completely blew me away. It looks like
something it would take years to master, (I only have three months to
do this project) and it seems that you have to be an expert in J2SE
before tackling J2EE.
If I went with .NET, I already have experience with Microsoft
development tools, so the learning curve might be quicker. But as my
previous experience is in Visual C++ 6.0, .NET will be a whole new
ballgame for me too. Oh, and I would have to shell out big money for
the Visual Studio toolset. It would be at academic price, and I
probably only need Visual C++ or C#, but it still costs money when the
J2EE environment is free.
What do you all think, given my past experience? I know there are
some people who abhor anything Microsoft, but being that I've worked
with early versions of the Visual Studio IDE, will .NET be a quick
learning curve? Or is J2EE not as hard to learn as it seems? If
anyone knows of any good tutorials on the internet, please point me in
that direction.
Also, since this is just for learning, the web services apps are not
going to be very elaborate, as I'm wondering if I'm already biting off
more than I can chew! However, I was wondering what people prefer
between .NET and J2EE and why. No flame wars, please, although I feel
that it's going to happen anyways.
Thanks for your feedback!
Herman
You can BEA WebLogic Platform 8.1 and get a 1-year developer license
free http://dev2dev.bea.com/index.jsp
The develop community and news groups are great for support http://www.bea.com/framework.jsp?CNT...stomer_support
A primary goal of the 8.1 platform is to make development easier with
visual tools and code generation. Check out the evaluation guide.
Best Wishes,
Wayne Scott
Common misconception about .NET.
Actually, .NET Framework SDK is free, and provides everything you need to
develop .NET applications (as long as you are willing to use the same IDE
that comes with JAVA -- command line :-): http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/d...displaylang=en
SharpDevelop is an open source C# IDE: http://www.icsharpcode.net/OpenSourc...4/default.aspx
"Jorge Rivera" <jo*****@rochester.rr.com> wrote in message
news:t7*********************@twister.nyroc.rr.com. .. The issue is what platform to use:
.NET or J2EE?
Student=broke="free tools"=Java.
You can develop web services using gSoap for C++.
I have read some of the postings regarding difficulty, and I completely
disagree.
You can pick up Java and NetBeans from Sun, install, and start creating
simple web services in no-time.
.NET and J2EE share some of the same porblems and virtues, it's just
that Java is free, .NEt is not.
Prior to starting my MSc course, I worked for a software developer for
five years where I wrote Windows apps in Visual C++. However, during
my MSc course (which lasts a year), we've been working in J2SE and
nothing else (as far as programming languages go). So even though I
have more experience in C++, Java is fresher in my mind right now.
Since we're learning J2SE, I took a look at the J2EE 1.4 tutorial on
Sun's web site, and it completely blew me away. It looks like
something it would take years to master, (I only have three months to
do this project) and it seems that you have to be an expert in J2SE
before tackling J2EE.
Just install the tools, run a web service example, or run one of the web
service project templates, and you will learn what really matters....
If I went with .NET, I already have experience with Microsoft
development tools, so the learning curve might be quicker. But as my
previous experience is in Visual C++ 6.0, .NET will be a whole new
ballgame for me too. Oh, and I would have to shell out big money for
the Visual Studio toolset. It would be at academic price, and I
probably only need Visual C++ or C#, but it still costs money when the
J2EE environment is free.
BTW, .NET is not any easire to learn than Java...
No flame wars, please, although I feel
that it's going to happen anyways.
Bring up a topic about two languages unrelated to C++ in a C++ newsgroup
is not the greatest of ideas to avoid this...
JLR
Nunya wrote: Common misconception about .NET.
Actually, .NET Framework SDK is free, and provides everything you need to
develop .NET applications (as long as you are willing to use the same IDE
that comes with JAVA -- command line :-):
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/d...displaylang=en
SharpDevelop is an open source C# IDE:
http://www.icsharpcode.net/OpenSourc...4/default.aspx
True, .NEt is free, but as you well mention, the tools are not. They
are very expensive, compare with the Java SDK/NetBeans combo (free) or
many of the free (can I mention multiplatform too?) IDEs.
BTW, in my opinion, .NET without the IDE is fairly mediocre...
JLR
Richard <rh***@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<MP************************@news.verizon.net> ... NU**@NULL.NULL wrote... Herman posted:
Hi everyone, I'm currently studying for my Master's in Computer
Science, and I will be working on my thesis this summer. I've been
thinking about constructing a web services application for my thesis,
as I've been interested in this technology, and I haven't had a chance
to work with it in my last job. The issue is what platform to use:
.NET or J2EE?
They're both abismal. I find it a joke that they can call it a "Master's"
when you're writing the program in the likes of .NET and J2EE.
Maybe it's a Mastercard Masters -- ie, night school. Nothing wrong
with it, but...well, don't ask 'em what a Turing machine is.
It's not a night school, it's one of the more prestigious universities
in the UK. But it's a "conversion" master's course, that is, it's
intended for those people who don't have a Bachelor's in CS, which I
don't. I started working in IT after college, and did this course to
further my knowledge.
BTW, a Turing machine is the machine described in a paper by Alan
Turing in 1936. It moves from one state to another using a finite set
of rules, and is generally considered to be the foundation of modern
computing. (as we learned in our computing environments module)
Also, if .NET and J2EE are abysmal, what other alternatives do you
recommend?
Paul Schmidt <wo*******@yahoo.ca> wrote in message news:<kZ*********************@news20.bellglobal.co m>... Herman wrote:
Your asking the wrong question, if you have a BCS you should know this
already. Which platform fits better for what YOU want to do, in the
constraints you have to live with. Don't say they are equal, because
they are not.
Some questions to ask yourself (you should know this already)
* What is the executing platform?
* How much do you need to master in order to do what you want to do?
* How far can you slide the time schedule?
* Which technology is going to be more useful after you graduate?
* Is this really what you want to do a thesis on?
I may be revamping a friend's online store to add a lot more
automating functionality, as right now everything on his store is
manually operated. But he is thinking of running everything off
Windows servers, and the clients will be web browsers.
He was talking about adding a whole slew of functionality to the site,
like what Amazon does, but for time constraints I'll probably going to
have to pick and choose what to implement given the deadline (which I
cannot slide back, since it's academic) I keep on seeing a lot of
want ads for J2EE, which is why I thought about doing a thesis on it,
since they haven't taught it to us yet, just J2SE (I'm in a
"conversion" Master's course, which is intended for people who do not
have Bachelor's in CS).
"Herman" <he*******@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:d6**************************@posting.google.c om... What do you all think, given my past experience? I know there are
some people who abhor anything Microsoft, but being that I've worked
with early versions of the Visual Studio IDE, will .NET be a quick
learning curve? Or is J2EE not as hard to learn as it seems? If
anyone knows of any good tutorials on the internet, please point me in
that direction.
Forget about which is easier to learn. You dont really have time to properly
learn either of them in the timeframe given.
Concentrate on your project's specification and design. Not sure about
masters courses, but for the BSc courses, not a great lot of marks went
towards implementation.
Think about what you want to do in the future. If you opt for a J2EE
implementation, you'll find it easier to apply for J2EE jobs in the future;
and vice versa. Your choice may have more of an impact than just a 3 month
implementation. Would you really want to settle for trying to learn the
easier language if that's not what you want in the future?
Does your college/uni have an educational license of Visual Studio .NET? You
may not have to fork out big bucks after all, even for your own educational
license.
I'll let the others rant on about the technicalities of the J2EE/.NET
decision, but IMHO an easy-to-use IDE is a great benefit when starting off
in something new. If it were my choice, I'd go for .NET.
Btw, which uni are you at? Queens in Belfast is gearing pretty much everying
towards J2SE these days. Not sure if they cover J2EE.
HTH,
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